Bartleby Blog
Using the Billy Collins poem, discuss how its meaning helps us understand Bartleby and the philosophical values which dictate his actions (or lack thereof) in the short story. Your contributions/comments need to occur at least 24 hours apart—don’t post two times in a row. Each comment must not exceed 75 words – so be concise!
At first I thought the poem was referring to Bartleby because it’s called “For Bartleby the Scrivener”. However, the image of a person “fully exerting the legs and swinging arms” only to be pushed backwards by the wind made me think of the boss. His attempts at reaching Bartleby are frustrating and fruitless, and he’s the one who moves backwards when he changes locations to accommodate Bartleby. Could the poem be addressing both of them?
I completely agree Dana, I thought that the poem could be interpreted for Bartleby or the boss. I think the boss himself might be in the same isolationism as Bartleby. The boss is submissive and due to that I feel that he might have fallen into his own isolation, thus the poem could be about him. But, the skater could be Bartleby because the ice skater fights against the wind and cold the same way Bartleby has to fight against society and it's forces against him. Bartleby does not follow the societal "norms" and does not even listen to his own boss. So by going against society, doing something that is out of the "norm," is your only option isolationism? Is that the end result for not fitting in with society?
Dana, I disagree. The poem is not addressing both Bartleby and boss because they are opposites. While Bartleby is incapable of functioning in society and "prefers" isolation, his boss is a "Master of Chancery" in New York, who interacts with his subordinates and other officers of the law.
For me, the poem suggests that certain people are more susceptible to isolation-implying that those who "refuse to batten down" rebel against societal norms, and wait for the wind (isolation), where they cannot hope to escape from its overpowering grasp.
I agree with Dana that the skater is the boss, but for a slightly different reason. Bartleby is someone who “battened down,”—what he “would rather not” do, he didn’t, and, although against society’s wishes, this wasn’t an entirely bad thing, as revealed by the use of euphemism for his death (“He’s asleep…with kings and counselors”). The boss, however, didn’t batten down, but led his life getting “pushed backward” by Bartleby’s and society’s wishes.
I agree with Ruth; I think that the poem is addressing people who choose isolationism. In the beginning, the poem doesn't recognize the existence of other people – the subject ("you") just skates along by himself. Also, it seems to say that if he were to acknowledge the other people, he'd have more motivation to "refuse to batten down" and would have a reason to stay on the ice instead of "fall[ing] on your ass and be[ing] blown into the forest". Going off of what Kristina and Ruth said about fighting the wind and cold - the presence of others would give him reason to fight and would keep him from giving into isolationism (the wind).
I personally must agree with Ruth as well, on the notion that the poem is not addressing the boss. This is indicated by the opening of the poem as it is addressed to only one person. However I find myself disagreeing with the concept that the wind is a symbol of isolation, due to the primary reason that at the end of the poem the wind lifts him up to sore among others.
I agree with Dana I think the poem is addressing both the boss and Bartleby. The skater that is being blown backwards is being suppressed by society. But the skater that refuses to be batten down is the isolationist, who refuses to give into societal values. Collins uses both types of people to give contrast between a “normal” person like the boss and an isolationist like Bartleby.
I don't agree with you Aaron, sorry. I don't think that the wind was lifting him up to soar with the others. I read it as wind was a necessary obstacle; it was the force that acts against people as they try to coexist with society successfully. I think that in a way, the wind is something that acts against each person differently. For Bartleby, it is the draw of isolationism; one that he gave into. Others were able to overcome the wind and "exchange knowing waves" that acknowledge the trials that they have overcome to ride against the "north wind".
Maggie, yes, the boss was a part of society, but he never mentions any desire to remove himself from society.
In addition, narrator's tone and diction celebrates the idea of not "batten[ing] down." It says, "you will exchange knowing waves as you ride the great wind north." From this it almost seems as if the wind, or isolationism, is still "great" despite how it seems to push until what can only be assumed are their deaths.
I didn’t intend to imply that the boss aspires to isolate himself, I should explain my rationale. I took the wind as being not isolationism, but society. Those who batten down against it (Bartleby) shield themselves against it and are unaffected by it. Many, however, don’t batten down, but allow themselves to be swept up in its influence and be helplessly dragged down (north) with the others who succumb to its power (“other flying people”).
Ruth, I’m confused about how the wind represents isolationism. If we go with the assumption that the ice skater, like Bartleby, is being isolated, then why does he end up riding the wind and “exchanging knowing waves” with others? Doesn’t that contradict the very idea of isolation, the concept that the skater is riding this supposedly isolating wind yet still manages to find some form of companionship?
I agree with Dana here, I do not think that the wind could be isolationism, because then he is greeting other people, which contradicts isolation. I also agree with Maggie that the people battening down are those who fight against values society puts on them. Bartleby never directly fights these values, he just “prefers not to” comply. The skater makes no attempt to fight the wind, he just battens down and stays strong against it.
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ReplyDeleteAt first I thought the poem was referring to Bartleby because it’s called “For Bartleby the Scrivener”. However, the image of a person “fully exerting the legs and swinging arms” only to be pushed backwards by the wind made me think of the boss. His attempts at reaching Bartleby are frustrating and fruitless, and he’s the one who moves backwards when he changes locations to accommodate Bartleby. Could the poem be addressing both of them?
ReplyDeleteI completely agree Dana, I thought that the poem could be interpreted for Bartleby or the boss. I think the boss himself might be in the same isolationism as Bartleby. The boss is submissive and due to that I feel that he might have fallen into his own isolation, thus the poem could be about him. But, the skater could be Bartleby because the ice skater fights against the wind and cold the same way Bartleby has to fight against society and it's forces against him. Bartleby does not follow the societal "norms" and does not even listen to his own boss. So by going against society, doing something that is out of the "norm," is your only option isolationism? Is that the end result for not fitting in with society?
ReplyDeleteDana, I disagree. The poem is not addressing both Bartleby and boss because they are opposites. While Bartleby is incapable of functioning in society and "prefers" isolation, his boss is a "Master of Chancery" in New York, who interacts with his subordinates and other officers of the law.
ReplyDeleteFor me, the poem suggests that certain people are more susceptible to isolation-implying that those who "refuse to batten down" rebel against societal norms, and wait for the wind (isolation), where they cannot hope to escape from its overpowering grasp.
Aaron was here
ReplyDeleteChrissy was here
ReplyDeleteI agree with Dana that the skater is the boss, but for a slightly different reason. Bartleby is someone who “battened down,”—what he “would rather not” do, he didn’t, and, although against society’s wishes, this wasn’t an entirely bad thing, as revealed by the use of euphemism for his death (“He’s asleep…with kings and counselors”). The boss, however, didn’t batten down, but led his life getting “pushed backward” by Bartleby’s and society’s wishes.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Ruth; I think that the poem is addressing people who choose isolationism. In the beginning, the poem doesn't recognize the existence of other people – the subject ("you") just skates along by himself. Also, it seems to say that if he were to acknowledge the other people, he'd have more motivation to "refuse to batten down" and would have a reason to stay on the ice instead of "fall[ing] on your ass and be[ing] blown into the forest". Going off of what Kristina and Ruth said about fighting the wind and cold - the presence of others would give him reason to fight and would keep him from giving into isolationism (the wind).
ReplyDeleteI personally must agree with Ruth as well, on the notion that the poem is not addressing the boss. This is indicated by the opening of the poem as it is addressed to only one person. However I find myself disagreeing with the concept that the wind is a symbol of isolation, due to the primary reason that at the end of the poem the wind lifts him up to sore among others.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Dana I think the poem is addressing both the boss and Bartleby. The skater that is being blown backwards is being suppressed by society. But the skater that refuses to be batten down is the isolationist, who refuses to give into societal values. Collins uses both types of people to give contrast between a “normal” person like the boss and an isolationist like Bartleby.
ReplyDeleteI don't agree with you Aaron, sorry. I don't think that the wind was lifting him up to soar with the others. I read it as wind was a necessary obstacle; it was the force that acts against people as they try to coexist with society successfully. I think that in a way, the wind is something that acts against each person differently. For Bartleby, it is the draw of isolationism; one that he gave into. Others were able to overcome the wind and "exchange knowing waves" that acknowledge the trials that they have overcome to ride against the "north wind".
ReplyDeleteAaron, then what is the wind?
ReplyDeleteMaggie, yes, the boss was a part of society, but he never mentions any desire to remove himself from society.
In addition, narrator's tone and diction celebrates the idea of not "batten[ing] down." It says, "you will exchange knowing waves as you ride the great wind north." From this it almost seems as if the wind, or isolationism, is still "great" despite how it seems to push until what can only be assumed are their deaths.
I didn’t intend to imply that the boss aspires to isolate himself, I should explain my rationale. I took the wind as being not isolationism, but society. Those who batten down against it (Bartleby) shield themselves against it and are unaffected by it. Many, however, don’t batten down, but allow themselves to be swept up in its influence and be helplessly dragged down (north) with the others who succumb to its power (“other flying people”).
DeleteRuth, I’m confused about how the wind represents isolationism. If we go with the assumption that the ice skater, like Bartleby, is being isolated, then why does he end up riding the wind and “exchanging knowing waves” with others? Doesn’t that contradict the very idea of isolation, the concept that the skater is riding this supposedly isolating wind yet still manages to find some form of companionship?
DeleteI agree with Dana here, I do not think that the wind could be isolationism, because then he is greeting other people, which contradicts isolation. I also agree with Maggie that the people battening down are those who fight against values society puts on them. Bartleby never directly fights these values, he just “prefers not to” comply. The skater makes no attempt to fight the wind, he just battens down and stays strong against it.
Delete